I’m Going, man, boy. Well I never know I would live 15 or 16. My life I had, I never, I wouldn't even lived as 20. No. Yeah, my god, I past 90 moving up again and it's only God. Only God do that for me. I got through some stuff, man. I can't even talk about them because people who didn't even look at me again as you one being because of the pride, but you must come from somewhere to get somewhere And I coming right back from the pit bat on the pit right at the bottom of the pit. No, I'm over the pit. Looking down in the pit. That's a long journey. That's a long journey.
 
Well I've got some pride for you, right? I do a radio show once a week. Okay, yeah. You do that every Sunday after the gospel show. And we just did our best of the year, best of 2023 because the year just end. Right. So we do our best blues song of the year, best Rhythm on blues song. Best Soul Song. And best Jamaican song. And this is the song that won best Jamaican song of 2023. You know this one? Oh, beautiful.
  
My whole personal thing that.
 
Yeah.
 
In my band. That's Carib Beat. Yeah. Who can beat that?
 
Is, is it Val Bennett who playing the...
 
Val Man played the horn? Yes. But he was in the band Full Caribbean to that Bobby Economic Caribbean that
 
So did that song. I can't see where that song ever came out on record. Did it ever come out on record?
 
Well I don't hear it, but a guy from Germany wrote me about it and claimed that he's sending me some money for it because lemme tell you how it will to go. He wrote me and sent me a contract right away. First he heard about send a contract, send this for this and this music, this ke doga and another sound, another weird sound, a
 
Crack attack?
 
Piddy boy?

No man
 
One Way Street Vampire?
 
None of those.
 
Some other
 
Song, it is a woman, I woman's sound, but I don't remember right now, but I can't remember. And he said, sign this and send me back. I didn't sign it, I don't know him. And that's it.
 
So how did I get this? How did it get out into the world
 
From the studio stolen, all that, what you play in Stolen?

Stolen from studio.
 
I do that next studio and we have no money, so just do it in the studio and oh, I can't pay for the studio time. So I come back next week or tomorrow, leave the tip right there. Went down, come back. By the time it playing on Australia, play in Japan overnight. They run off a tape. I in half,
 
But never came up on vinyl. Just from the tape.
 
Yeah, just come up and have a few, few, I don't even, no record of them. Only one was street I got record from and they just last year, just last year a guy had to do it and he do it. And
 
These sessions here, these ones that they stole the tape, where did you do them?
 
This session? Yeah, West Indies. This which is dynamic and saw them done Pater, Lyndon Pottinger with Gay Fee and some of them done at Federal Studio and SC in particular.

​Do you remember where you did that one? Which one? SC Bodaga. The one we played before
 
Y Man, that was Western Days. It was Western Days and it was a Wednesday, like 32.
 
Why you remember the
 
Day of the week? I remember everything. Wow. I not good at computer, but I remember every song I sing, every song I play. Who played? I remember all of them. I don't have the rings with the computer. I don't know why.
 
So can you tell us who was the core of the Carib Beats?
 
Nobody else but I man this man, this man Make of Caribbean until Caribbean split up and fit back again and split again. But nobody managed beat, nobody helped car beat. And that's why I couldn't go no further and just trash it out. But car, anything you see Mark Carib beat, grab it. If it mark Carry, I don't say Carib and be, no, no, that's the word really. But instead of Caribbean, just carry, beat, anything about the Caribbean was done out of my pocket. I'm stolen our here from my pocket.
 
I should get you to introduce yourself. What's her name and what instrument do you play?
 
I play a guitar technically I play own a guitar. Those are the men that play the guitar. Mr. Yo Eugene, you are one of my influences. Yeah, a few of them that he really rip up some fire on them, but the rest I played them and nobody else no played. Me and him. We started at nobody house. So we just stuck over that.
 
And what's your name?
 
And that is Bobby Akins. But in that secular world, but if I gone in the gospel world, Bobby Ss is my right name. My right name.
 
And your name is misspelt all the time. Sometimes it's Bobby Atkins. Yeah, sometimes Bobby Akin. Sometimes it's Bobby Akin A KIN. I
 
See. Oh that's spell the American. Spell it and can But it pronounce Akin fine. Fine.
 
But I think on your first record, which I have
 
Ah, arch Bella, that's his word. The one were looking for Arch Bella.
 
Right. But there was a song called Crackers Rush.
 
I did that. The first very song I ever did in my life for a song Sister man named KP until Bo grab it and sell it to Charlotte because never wrote my second song with Bo.
 
It came out on Blue Beat, right? Yeah. But I have it on the Jamaican label. Blues. B-L-U-E-S.
 
Yes. They do all kind stuff with them. I have no control, I only hear them. I can't do nothing. I don't know who to go to. I sit down and go to bed hungry while the pocket fuller.
 
I was going to ask you, what is that song about? Because I've never been able to work out what it means. Karo. Yeah.
 
Well then you are the first man that me that. And I think I want to tell it to you. I don't want why nobody asked me about it. Can't take off my heart. Right, stop you. It was a time when crackers, Jamaican crackers was very scarce and when you go in the shop to buy, if you want a dozen crackers, so then the shop one or two. So I say give me one more crackers just to make my penny pen. You give one two G five, seven. No, six 19 here. One, two, G, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, 10. You understand? Yeah. Right. So one on missing. So that's why I make it not leaving her, I'm not leaving it. I want it that one to make up my score.
 
They were rationing the biscuits? Yes, rationing. But they rush it, rushing to get it. Yeah, they rush. Right. And that's spelled Bobby Akins. A-K-I-N-S-A-I-T-K-N. No, A-K-A-K-I-N-S. That's who that was stood out but is akin. Anyway, so who played on that record? Recall is snapping to Beford. He's on piano. Alan Park Drum, John Bagel Pego and another wild guy that I picked up on to play, to play guitar. And it was kind of there. And then saxophone, the guy, they call him number one, a saxophone is he wore really a number one. That was his name was number one. Yes, that's the name we know. Really? Yes. And then the thing you see him, you see with him is number one. You see. So we don't know what the number one, there's some funny names. Wasn't a saxophone player called Blues? Just called Blues One. You ever hear him? I know Blues, but Blues a bass player. Oh. Oh
 
By the way, can you keep recording in case something goes wrong? We've got a backup. Yes, yes. Thank you. So the crackers rush, did you hear it in sound system or did you ever get a copy?
 
Yes, yes. Had a copy one time and because I wasn't in the music much, I just come in and mess around and just getting around and different kind of lifestyle was in construction, jumping around.
 
You were working in construction at the time?
 
Yeah, I'm a good construction guy. When music slow, that's where I go. And when that slow I go back to music.
 
How old were you when that came out?
 
Cracker as Rush
 
61. I
 
Was about two. What? Thirties? Thirties they were.
 
So you had a couple of releases of On Count P. Well you had the other side was Hello. But then you worked with Prince Buster Proper on Never. Never.
 
Yes. No, it is now. When I did Crack Rush, he heard it and I think he love it because it was blues. Because those days, boy don't play blues. Not everybody play blues. Even right now you talk about blues, they don't know. So one day I just get musical, I don't know, I just get musical and a lady had a little hand tape and I took it and I started to sing. So I sung Never, never. It wasn't made up yet. But I like Louis Prima and then they love some of these girls sing group girling. They sing All Lay On and Louis Prima. So I put piece of Louis, piece of Louis piece of that grew up and piece of myself and it come out to Crackers Rush Never, never.
 
No. Trevor Charlie.
 
Charlie was there. Charlie was there. The one that I got to bed hungry with
 
Was a big hit,
 
Biggest hit not for me yet. I get to bed hungry. Not even food to eat, but let me straighten this part, this song, it was new one I was talking about a while ago. It was Isabella, the other side.
 
The other side. Oh yes, Isabella.
 
Yeah, this is that was the one that took pri.
 
Oh this is the one with the Louis pri in it.
 
No, Isabella. Yes, that is the one I make up with three different songs. But never, never. I just did that.
 
You said Prince Buster didn't pay it proper.
 
It's a long story, right? I took the little tape that the lady had now and went down to Duke read a place where they do recording and all that and principal just saw me there and said, what's up Mr Never Mr. Cracker Rush. They call you your first record, already name you by your first record that you make. Said what up from Crock ro? I said, I'm here. He said, what you have there? And I said, I said alright, what up, what up? And I took out some money, I think it was five bones or eight bone and give it to me just like that. I said meet me at Dynamic Tuesday morning with the song just like that. I was broke, I was hungry, I almost naked. And that was big money for me, man, just give you some money like that and say meet me them. He said. I said okay. So I went down no for the cutting. I've never, never, he loved it.
 
Well he loved it so much that he ripped it off.
 
Yeah. So he sent me down. That's speed up that.
 
That's Prince Buster All stars rerecorded.
 
Yeah. Nothing about that. Yeah, no the speed change him.
 
Oh you think he's the same recording? You just said
 
C, just peel it faster.
 
I think they add some horn too that
 
Like
 
Scar horn,
 
Like this late one that I did Kiss Baba like that. Like that. They just add something to it and change the name
 
And doesn't pay you again. I bet.
 
Nothing. Nothing.
 
So who were your favourite artists, American artists that inspired you?
 
American artists. I really have no have no American artist favourite or the Ray Charles. That's a guy with me. But otherwise
 
Were you like Louis Priman?
 
I loved him. Yes. I love style John and Louis Priman much. He ain't steal. Same kind guy. But otherwise I love nobody else because they never hold me. I have a whole stuff in here. We don't have no space to can contain their stuff. I went charge about Phillip up looking somewhere to put it out. Tell we go to the studio and I'm going to tell you the Isabella, just because I was in jail, the two stuff that I make it not meant to be that I meant to be but the musician following my move and believe that I made a cut and the cut too. You understand? And I don't say I just leave it like that. I know that don't even know it the cut because I was using my hand and I was technically dancing while I singing the court work it all too. So that's a mistake that become a beef stick.
 
So how did you learn guitar? Did you teach yourself? Did you have a teacher?
 
Yeah, no, I cannot do anything without that teacher. That teacher God himself. Yes. I've been given the gift of guitar one night. One night I wake up the other man and playing. Never had a guitar, never bought a guitar, never borrowed a guitar. But it lead me to the story that I had in my book. I was in the reeling back because to learn the guitar, I have to go back down in the pit because I was thrown in the pit to die. My parents die and I was on the street, me and my little brother, nine and 10-year-old and they never had nowhere to put me. The government have a place where they teach children musical thing. But when my sister, my big sister took me there, we were too big for that. Only place she could put me is in the arms house, the poor house you hear about arms house, a poor a place here come out back, still there and dead.
 
That's why she put us because she couldn't carry us home. Our husband was against us coming at his house. So she put me right in the arms to Wil brother, eight or nine, 10 years old, hundreds of big old people is there in that institute is a big institute. And I want to feed you and calm unself. You understand? And the long story, if you read a book you see a lot more. But I don't give any much to hear. And the government, I said government have a school where they collect the children and teach them music. But we were too old to join that school. But one Christmas, the government, since those kid come to that institute where we at to play music, man to guy, 10 years old, 12, 10, 12, 14 plays a big fat instrument. Sometimes when they stand up at to blow it, tired on him said what this man, what doing? And when I look around in the Christmas season, they come to play the Christmas sound for us to entertain, entertain, entertain. Remember that word?
 
And they did a session in the night and went away. And when they gone all clear from the, we was in the institute, thousands of people in there. They got the people sick, they were bringing in when they're sick and old and they die and go. But we did so young, what God said let good when the kids leave, when he left the place and gone back, me alone, my liquor brother sit down. So let me leave my little brother out of it right now. Just me. I said, God I don't know you. I hear people talk about you. I see them go to church and dress up themself to feel good. I don't know what I said. But if you are a true God, if you are really for real, give me the music that when I leave this compound I can go through the world and entertain others.
 
That's the word I used in my 10 years old the night and the other man, I wake up, I got a in tin and a piece of board and I start to make up a guitar, a banjo, a little ping ping and tie some electric wire on it and start to ping, ping, ping, ping that says one night, the first night. And I said, all right. And while I was there, ping, ping, ping, ping, I started to go up the scale and corner. I know the scale do. If I was a Latino, I tried to play it not how it should play. But I, the sound and little guy from over the other side of the institute heard me and said, Hey boy, I hear if you want to reach some place, I got little banjo. I go give it to you. And he went family to ban goat skin banjo and give it to me. And man I catch up some fire on that bun until it burn off. I pray something, I pick, I pick, I pick, I picked it, I start pick good and it break up. So that after I left that institute they two another institute again, Le Institute, granted we have leprosy, we can't stay in the institute because we have leprosy. Take us to the other leprosy institute in Spanish town. And we spent two years there. A Chinese doctor came there and said, what these guys doing in here take them out.
 
So they moved me again. But when I went to that institute, they had instrument there man. And I worked them, no schooling, just music and cut grass at the time institute so big. And then I did two years there. So the Chinese doctor said take them out and I take them out. I put me on another institute two more year again. So my life just spent shovelling through the dump and so on. And it was kind of good there. The people had a guitar there, the last one. And I worked that guitar every evening I worked that guitar. But before that I skip a big piece. But if you read the book you'll see it. I used to feed from the garbage thing, the garbage you eat and throw in the garbage at the roadside. I used to feed from that. When mom and papa died, my grandfather died nowhere to sleep, nowhere to drink, nowhere to eat, wear clothes that if you took me you dirt stick on, no place to sleep, no place to wear nothing.
 
So I go the in the symmetry and a broad tomb and I'll take a nap on the tomb because the sun is hot and clothes is I extreme beside it to I just wait up the clothes and put them and just sleep there. And until it dry get up, move again and go out and start the garbage thing to find food to eat. Then I leave from there. I go to the donger where the truck load and unload. You know the place, the truck I unload stuff, garbage dump stu. Garbage dump. And then you'll have the pig and the goat and the cows and the dogs and everything digging me digging too. Amen. I start it in the book there too. And the picture too me digging too. And sometime when I see something to pick up the dog, whatever them would rush me and I would rush him back because I want to pick it up first. A piece of bread, a piece of old dumpling, a piece of piece of old banana. I pick it up, brush it off from the dump in the dump where dog and cold shit every day I didn't have it. And then I wasn't rude, I use that word because it was what happened. I tell you what happened in the past and I don't want to change the world to make it look good. That's what happened.
 
The animal sit and we take it up and wipe it up and eat it not catch me anywhere. I sleep. That's where I sleep as well. To stand up and sleep. Yeah you so reach that part. And so far as a far to reach is very reached. Now the dump, the last place the institute, we just was there until we reach 18, 19 the send man road. Now they have to let me go because government more then I get Jan Young because I have to eat, I drop the trailer, I don't have the body. So I general gang, I sleep where they sleep, eat what I eat, steal what they steal. But I never got to jail. All of them go to jail except me because I had it here I am not going to jail. I am going to learn a trade and I had it all.
 
So even though I could ping pong, the guitar, liquor, but I go in and the story is very long. But I get to learn that trade I from my uncle and all this happened because my mother and father all Jamaican and they married and went to Cuba as a honeymoon and never contact nobody back in Jamaica till 10 of us born over there, 10 of us has no contract. So they have Ahad and father, all the rest people in Jamaica have them up and I don't around them. So when they come back to Jamaica we had little kid and quakes after they just die. So that caused all these things that we all living like crab and laser on the street just like that. Now John and the young, they would go and steal and all that thing and come on out. But I be the watchman all the while watching when the police coming for everybody coming. But one night I was at a place where they decide to tear on a place I must've killed the man or what, but I was the watchman that time I was like 21, like 21.
 
In those days police don't not like these. They wear a hilltop helmet on the ride horses and a beat duty in the night. So one night I was there, this guy named gone down the road to go do them stuff and I'm up the road watching to tell him, well right there believe it. Yes or not. I see a seen, I see Cuba and I start to cry. God I know I'm coming from and I shouldn't be here. My father, we had it in Cuba. We had two cars in Cuba and a big upstairs out in the bakery. I'm coming and doing all this thing Job Jamaica car.
 
And I say I'm going, they got them down there trying to get into my house and I turned they down the knot and I turned the other side, leave one right away, walk 30 miles one night. I know about my uncle, they be the contractor. I walk, walk, walk, walk. And when I reached the house, I knocked the window. I was like two o'clock or something. I said, me, Bobby, oh your mother. I said, no Don don't call the name. I wasn't there, I didn't do nothing. I am here. I need help. And gave me two shilling that time. Two shilling, a big money, very big money and a big pants. A big pants. Could I wrap around me two times? Yes. And he said meet me at University Gate in the morning because he was the contractor at the university building a big tech contractor. So everybody set me on to work. Now I learned how trade, I said okay. And I walked there now another 18 mile to go to university. And I reached there in time, stay at the gate and finish sleep.
 
The morning he called me, he set me on to the watchman and said let this boy stay with you. I teach him trade. And from there I learned to trade so fast. You wouldn't believe it until they gave me a name, they called me. Good, good. I lay black fast, I plaster fast, I do everything and I do it good when the whole gang start to go to lunchtime at daytime me pick up the tool, I'm fooling with it. I want to come back quick Mason, good mason too. And I live to see that man asking me to hire him man. I start to work, get contracts and blah it start right there. Then I start to getting the music now but it of instrument and blah blah blah. And we was to the musician. But I make my own instrument because I'm good at them stuff and all the musical area here. I made the guitar on the bass and one time I had a two neck guitar too. A bass. I have the picture of it too. And I turned it into one, turned it into two, split it again, same one and come out. Never come out of it. So
 
On all your recordings, were you playing guitars you built?
 
Yeah, everyone. I never buy a guitar until I reach up here.
 
Wow, that's unbelievable.
 
I never buy a guitar reach up here. You see I made it and it had a song that nobody has. You understand? And because I didn't play it all right, this is the master. He knows that you have to read a book, you have to go by certain rules. He know everything. He a big time teacher. I don't know nothing. I just pick around and what song go to me, I put together and even to the right now, I can't read music. I think in the first year way I know that. No I know. Oh I carry music. But don't make around sound. You can spoil the music and I'm here. No way. True. Your ears are sharp. No way.
 
I mean in band I've been in band to get the light. I've been out with all different bands, carry the music. But I know sound, I don't know what the card name but I know how it sound. And I just make my card. I play. I just play. Never a man show me anything on a guitar. Never a man show me anything on a banjo. Nothing at all. Never. Never would I teach plenty people. Songs. Songs. I know this monkey. I tell you some what most of what I know song more how I know myself. Just make around so I tell you. So I'll tell you I to keep you. I just God give it to me. So because I make that arrangement with the planet, the devote God said when I come out. So when I get converted now I make sure even before I converted, I love church and I find the church and pray for them and pray for them and pray for them all.
 
Even though I'm doing it right now, I'm playing for church right now. And the thing about it, when I was in the secular world, nothing was just in the studio world with the all guys and in wrangling kids stood that and saw Moran Shakespeare. I slide on Barron Glad and Hawks Brown and all kind man. And I played all kind of right Shirley, I sing, I play for him a lot when they're rehearsing the song, I'm outside smoke a cigarette. I don't rehearse with nobody, no just rehearse. I ready cut out. So I come inside said okay move. And I move with them like where we did. I have that kind of talent. I know when I'm going next, when I leave this I know where I'm going next. And because of that I can flourish. I can't make flourishes for the song even before I hear them. Yeah, yeah. And who tell this? My God tell you a lot about my substance touching music. I do music in him seriously. But what I guy don't, nothing. And I just kick it off and ing up and everybody start to tell you, oh ow we bringing rocks to the we bringing nothing. They dunno how actually come in. They dunno how reggae come in. They dunno how scare come in. They don't know how soccer come in. They dunno what it is. They call everything from Jamaica and call the reggae and it's wrong. I bring that thing I say I heard I something just do that I did with Mike because show you anytime on me and my time. And so
 
Reggae music, it started first with Kaso Ultimate Brother. Will you have it?
 
I've got it if you want me to play it.
 
It is so like you papa,
 
So
 
Like you.
 
Who is that guitar
 
Player that say it sound like you?
 
I wasn't there yet.
 
No it wasn't me. It wasn't me. But we have a better Es in Rock Steady.
 
Oh okay.
 
Yeah. That everybody wanted and I hang on to it man. This is not They one we have right though We have it
 
One that you did back when and you just have it on a tape or is this
 
No, my since it since I up here, since I copy up, I played that and I have the Rock 31 Rock.
 
You should record that here. Yeah, you could
 
Record that. It's recorded already. Oh
 
Done.
 
Yeah, from Jamaica. I do from Jamaica. I bring it up and I don't give nobody a piece of it. Oh
 
What year did you do it?
 
I think it is right in 67.
 
Oh you should sell that. You should take it to Japanese and get them to sell it
 
Japanese. No, no, no.
 
Can I get, this is making a bit of noise on the microphone. This plastic bag,
 
This
 
Plastic thing. I'll put it here. Is
 
That right? The plastic thing?
 
Yeah. Do you mind I put that there. Is it just come up on the thing?
 
Follow
 
It always sounds louder on a recording. I'll just put that there. But you were saying, so you saying start off me
 
Have long way better than that. I not cal it Rocks steady. Rocks steady Love Steady did it in Jamaica. Yeah, did it in Jamaica.
 
Man there's money long, way better than that. There's money to be made on putting that out. I'm just telling you, you could put that out and make some money. But you were saying so Jamaican music, what people don't know is it's not all reggae. It start with Calypso mento.
 
Well I started out with Calypso with my brother. I did, but I haven't got more than that Then. Then it go up to the scare. The scare, they go up to the rock Steady cause there other blues between the two scare and then go up to the reggae. Then they bring in the soak car that they're got to treat and get that. But Rock Steady is reggae, choppy, choppy, choppy, choppy. I got the mother of Chuck up up, Chuck up, Chuck up. I want just cha cha cha. So reggae and rock. Two ing music because So what is on there? You played them My rocks today. They're not sweet but just 200 re style put down there Chicken. Okay, see? See him go. What you call Mark? I told Ray, Ray,
 
I'll give you an example. See this is one of my favourite rocks today. So
 
I remember this
 
Baby. I
 
Lovekin. Yeah,
 
That's rock steady. That is rock Steady. If they strike look longer, it'll be a scare sky. What? They just, if that short, the liquid language would be a scar music, but it attracted the music. That one.
 
So that's 66 when scars slowing down, right? Yeah, bit like this one is but they
 
Call it anything then just give it anything.
 
This one is right on that edge of scar. Rock steady too. See if you remember this one
 
Box George Rock Steady speed up Ka speed up.
 
Yeah. Who were the rulers? Do you remember them? Yeah. Yeah
 
I I'm more too, what about the Jamaica and Ethiopians? Nothing for Ethiopians. All them JJ sang them then maybe I I'm to them. Yeah.
 
You recorded a lot for Rio records?
 
Yes, yes, yes. And still got lot, lot of time to a bit hungry while we doing them No money.
 
We were playing before a song. Oh by the way, before we get to that, so can we just get quick facts. Did your gang have a name? The gang you were in? Did it have a name?
 
No, it just a random thing. Just young guy just start group up together and just go around and steal.
 
What part of
 
I about anything. Just steal that movie. I go around and we share it to part no gang had a name. We never
 
What was your yard then? Where was it? In


​Kingston. On the street. Infield town. Town. Just just thi and go.
 
And so your parents were born in Jamaica but they went to Cuba and had you
 
Kids there? 10 of us there. And now we come back to Jamaica. All God, me alone, alive, all nine, dead me alone alive. And I know that purpose. Why God keep me back. None of them. I live my age. None.
 
And what else was I going to say? What age were you when your parents passed?
 
When they passed? My father, well I was like six years old. My father passed. I was like eight years old. My mother went to, and when I say my father passed, he wasn't dead but they grabbed him and took him to a place, the Spanish, the leprosy. So he left it. But I never know I was a man that your ain gone to work. I don't know when they send me el, I meet my father there. Kai know. Tell say I'm coming. They said I meet my father now at 12-year-old and we left him there. And instead until he died,
 
You were talking about blues came before Calypso and Scar. Right? What I love about this record is
 
The blues is the old one. The old one. The first one.
 
Yeah. So on this record, I don't know if you arranged it, you can tell me. But it starts off with the blues and then goes into rock Steady
 
Lord Jesus. Hello that number.
 
So do you need this one? Listen, same guy.
 
Sorry sir. Hello. And break off two little branch, go have a tree and give Winston. I say Winston you play the drum tonight. And he did. I never leave that drum until it become Winston going on.
 
So Winston went and played drums Most of the time.
 
All the time, yeah.
 
And what about keyboards? Who most often play keyboards with the characters
 
Was a lot of people. Tony, one guy named Tony mc Beam, he then, most of the time it was Ro Conrad. Cooper. Cooper. And another time it was what this guy, I forgot his name. His name, he was an Collins. But I taught him too. He was my baggage boy. Whenever we go he pack the baggage and pack. Come home. No, no music. I one day I said I see and he sleep at my home too. He didn't but I go home, I said I went down down one day I saw this piano, electric piano for 100 pound and I bought it, took it home and I said S come this name A so, and that was it is an Collins. He never leave start to play first for me and start play for everybody I know an Collins talking of. But oh I played, I started talking about cook and all lie I started nothing. He start at my home, sleeping at my yard, playing my piano, feeding me, feeding him every day. Every day the musician, they find my home with that big, that big circle yard. Everybody know that place. I would cook at work, curing dinner, calm me, floor dumpling every day. Every day first, first year that and all come to get a dumpling there too.
 
So what musician come around to your yard?
 
All those who? The one who work with me, the fellow guy come because dumpling Bobby every mid the big cur Flo dumpling and sal and butter and they come eat and go. I stay there and get till they learn until they learn, never get into play. So for more and we had a big fun.
 
So other than Ansel Collins, what other artists were you close to friendly with or you helped or they helped you or who were your friends in music?
 
A lot. A lot. A lot. A lot. They asked me question plenty and I showed them what the lead guitarist, I showed a lot. One day I was going to Jamaica and he was coming out Jamaica Ram meet at the airport and where the reach and stop and he said, Barry you are here. I said yes. And he put down the guitar strap. He take up the guitar of his back and said everybody look here. This is my teacher, this is my teacher. Big airport crowd. Just advertisement like that. This is my teacher because they know him, they take him by the champion. So he showing everybody say, oh my champion was sitting man who bring the champion. I see him here. I didn't feel good still but it I take it too loud.
 
That's Chin Smith. Yeah,
 
Chin Smith. Nice guy. Yes. Last time I go down there it show me a photograph. I would take photograph together and I mix up So too I make, oh God if I no like this I carry something but I make some sound without that purpose too. I don't just make a well song. It have some purpose.
 
Yes, I'm in Jamaica. I fly to Jamaica tomorrow night. So maybe I said Una Smith when I'm down there,
 
I don't know the area but I think he's punched
 
Over. No he's got a yard in Kingston. I've been to his.
 
You went there?
 
Yeah, he's saying last time I was there, Ken Booth came and sang his big, big yard.
 
Nice guy. One
 
As his big Rasta orchestra kind of thing. Yes. So you were doing the early Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe he got it after you.
 
I was there and he had some picture there with me and we take some picture together. But I showed one he had something to do and he didn't know what to do. And I show him, I run on the guitar and I show him that run. He said that make me and him close up. I run on the guitar that he never hear no anybody with it and say well move from this to that. I just tie them together on one big run. You you know them stuff but tie up two or three cards together. You got a good lick.
 
Yeah, I'm got play you a song and when I finish you tell me what you remember about it or what you think about it. Right.
 
No that's a different paragraph though. Right. Last one, that last song I made last secular song. This don't get nothing you me, Jack and Guy.
 
A drama guy.
 
Yeah. Who and drums? Yeah, no him name Alan Scott. Alan Scott.
 
And what's he playing?
 
Drum be playing and Jackie playing bass with the left foot and I going up here two Decorat, the left foot alone. You hear it now you see it in the picture. They show you bungalow white people on it. But then saw a three black man played me, Alan Scatter Jack too. Nobody else. Nobody else.
 
How did that session happen?
 
Charlie was there too. Charlie was there but blowing up and just say so and say can wheat two times Can wheat. So he have the name of the song in it too. They take the call four hours. Nobody is, but what I see on the picture on the CD is a bone black eye blown. Never, never. Then four of us Charlie can beat and that mute a beat. I brought it from Cuba noise. It sounds very cute one to me. Yes, that's exactly what I said. It brought it from Cuba and another one I brought that from Cuba too. Nobody else said they know it. I brought it, God four years old. I was in Cuba when I hear all these music I had rive here. I don't know why but
 
So you reckon you brought that rhythm
 
From Cuba? Yes. I come to Jamaica and played and played and then printed a mash up the nce and they all thing they play with it, conversation, all kind stuff, whatever. I brought that beat from Cuba.
 
So you think it's related to my conversation Rhythm
 
Do
 
It's related to my conversation rhythm. Is that what you say?
 
Anything it play with anything we were playing dear. I planned to see to the conversation cause it was car that's again full car beat again now with Bonnie Lee. Touch him. Oh Lord.
 
Is it true that my conversation licked the drummer came up with that?
 
No my me bro. You don't tell them what to play Band leader. Anytime I say me carried the band leader,
 
Yes, but that record you don't get it doesn't say the Cara beats. I didn't even know you were playing on it.
 
No they're none going to say that. A lot of stuff Bunny Lee make you don't know. You don't even hear my name earlier. I don't even get paid or Bunny Lee and Scott Perry. The whole of my sweat. Hold of my sweat.
 
What did you do for Scratch?
 
Holy heap buried him for him. Holy heap whole heap. Me too. I get lunch money. I played a lunches share for two person.
 
Let me play a song first. I love this song. I dunno why it's an early one from you. You did for a producer. We haven't mentioned yet
 
Today I stand before you Mr I pray that you won't.
 
I welcome. Lemme know Champion come back. Nowadays that whole album, their mines, mine Mine, my Prince King Edward Thief. I finally do it. Up to this day you did not all same. 1960 I think 66 and 67 I went to the studio and I make me song them and give a change to make up for studio. You ain't give me. But for the days this song make I don't seem to this day. To this day I don't see again only hearsay in England working in coal mine. So here nothing more. I go to Jamaica, I can't find him. King Edwards, I heard it all Doors on my son stolen and he could other watch. I put my name on them because it would be unfair words but me to them, I arrange them out to them.
 
Is that all that King Air with stuff like prime Minister State or the instrumental or
 
Everything that is on with the labour Giant Labour Giant.
 
Everything. We catch it. Good side of mistakes. Every one. The 12 song. I match my music personally. Music, when he go us to that period, he at the keyboard. He at the turntable. Mr. He and he wanted to tell you something. You're not going to believe it. One hour I take out to the 12 some one hour, one hour I joke. But one hour. That's why went Tamari came to my home with a guy, the guy let him know it was there too. And there's one hour you can do because those time one hour, if you know what you're doing, you can do some playing music band. But if you know what you're doing trouble from a tight band. Yeah. One hour I just caught no playback caught no playback cut, no playback cut 12 time. And I hear them and I go to you know where I hear it.
 
First in England after I done cut his session, he was calling my way to America to his brother and he just took a session and move. See I know but I'll got England go buy it off the shelf. They normally have a whole seedy of it now. Yeah, whole CD of it. No Avenger. Yep. My purse that money do that. Nobody can sue me for nothing. But if I wanted to pursue whatever, I could have sued the war, whatever. But I don't fight about it for nothing soon that I left Garden and then soon then too. I missing soon. That so far done. I'm all right, I'm living and I just steal to live.
 
Did you ever work with Mr. Goody? Very much. I much with him with secular and gospel. I have a gospel that it mix for me. Oh my god I still have it. When it stood the breakdown, it was passing through on the dynamics and I said go to mix. And he just take it up, up, put it down. I said whoop mix set me up. And when he died, no but was one the no yes. Was one the best engineer C Buckner. C Buckner was very good. Yeah, I remember C, yeah C very good guy. But one coming down in food after I ask these my do ask they what to do when you see them asking you too much question. They're learning from you and you have to pay them to learn them.
 
Did you ever see any members of the Caribs, the original Caribs, the Australian band, the car, Dennis Ry
 
Dennis? No, I never used to them. Neither am never used to them neither. And one A, just something I never used to them. Never played nothing with them.
 
Well he did play with Charlie er a lot.
 
No, he played with us. He was in the band. Oh yeah. Yeah. Already in the band. We started together. Me and him started with Caribbean together. Me and him. I
 
Love this song. This may be one of my favourite records that I own, right? This one.
 
Now his liquor village that his own that's Charlie is own with Can Ride playing with the same hundred pound piano. They knew but it got it over now. But it don't sound like this. This is the original environment.
 
Yeah, there's a second version of it. But this is the rock steady versions.
 
They were not about that's the first cut.
 
So Charlie, what was he like?
 
Charlie? Charlie no more
 
Good singer too on that track. Did he write that one little village? Yeah,
 
Yeah, yeah. He makes a few some otherwise but I don't hear them.
 
Yeah,
 
You hear man about town.
 
Don Drummond. Which one
 
Then Charlie come in it in the venture, the group with the
 
King. You got the better of me there. I'm pretty good. But I didn't know that one. You worked with Evan and Jerry. Jerry being Jerry Mattias out of Mate
 
Music. I love his music. It started to be, I was in Caribbean also.
 
Jerry was
 
Jerry
 
On Mattias.
 
What name again? Jerry. Hold on. So then near Miss. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Mark something. Jerry, Yuan, mark Jerry Yuan Mark. So like that
 
Yuan
 
Yan. Yeah, Yan Yoan Yan.
 
You and McDermot
 
Dermot. Yeah. That's my friend. Yeah. Very good man. He cool man. Oh
 
Yeah, he's the yuan in Yuan. And Jerry is Yuan McDermott?
 
No, Jerry
 
And who's the Jerry?
 
Jerry look like one of his son. His son sing with him too. His son sing with him And man is fighting now over the tape. And I have a few of them but I have fool because not my own.
 
And I mean your brother obviously was in music too but you never recorded with him. No, that's Laurel.
 
No, no me no good. He was so jealous of me. I'm full and gifted. I didn't know it. And from before even music days, he tried to push people side so I don't get to surpass him in life. The first album I make, I stole it until they took Amman Hayat at Spencer Road at Dr. Man. Dr Man job store man named Hayat first album. I stole it. I have it Hayat give it the money to make it and me make it for me. And Hayat I where my brother come from England, he might hire was two key friend more than key and the take C the thi for me, I make it a lp. I took it to England and sell it and give Hyatt 100 pound and that's it. I either don't get nothing and it was a blue beat labour, I don't get nothing. And I remember so sound was on it. Trouble
 
Was that scar stuff.
 
Scar stuff have bending
 
And
 
I have to go check it to go the rest of whatever brains.
 
I'd love to hear them. I dunno what songs those are. But anyway, so you and Laurel never got on? Never,
 
Never. When he went to England, I was on my face but still play music. So I write him, I said why where those send for me? Let the boat us be in England and tear on England. He showed up your backside, you two bulk rain in a wild pen. In other words you can't have two champion one place while him do it. And he was don't even know what I play. My brother don't know what I play. I went to England twice and then passed me out every day and they check me afraid of me because in young days he know I was good at this. I do good back and I punch hard and see me do things already. And I'm afraid to face me can believe I would knock him out too. He know that you're wrong. So he don't bother me. So I go to England and try to find him.
 
I but alright, stay down, pass you today. He really pass and go down to the studio, go. I go back every day, run a place, never check me and I go back. I again, 92, 91, 92. I go back 98 save until again and keep away from me. Ask me, is what you play is what you play? No. You still play the bass guitar, play guitar, play for myself, especi. I not get rid guitar. He don't know what I play. But it was jealous. I don't want me because in his banner among his people and in dicey way, the last thing he asked me, Mr. Judge and jury, that time I think he was sick. I assume get sick. He said, did that sound judge and jewellery who did it? Me Are you because it's sounded alike. I said even you do this, you'll remember that in my tune. But as brother, do what you want to do with it and look after him died.
 
So he don't know what he don't know to play. Not even that. And it's a shame. He's a she man. I thought to him, sorry, I sorry, I sorry. You know what? He did all my song in uk. He came down one time when I was going to school, I said school. The government gave me a place in school One time when it was setting me up to go the teacher, the training centre to teach construction, the government send me to school for a year and just do that in six in eight months. Done while I was going to school I could jump around the studio every day go after to go to school. My brother came down and we got to Tubby. So he come to buy our steel Joan. So he know I have the music, he know I have five tape, take me around Tubby and give me 400 ju candle after every tip.
 
He said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Nobody like that. I didn't know what they did. He got me full. Got me full. He said, I want to know where you live and in talk to Toby. In other words give Toby the tip. I said roll them out till we come back. He going to walk, walk from there to my home. But the time we come back and roll out all of the music, that's what I consider the guy hear them after that England to they roll them off for him and get favour to that. But that work, he just advertise me. He advertise me. No problem.
 
Well you've had an incredible career like playing in these records that probably didn't seem like anything at the time. They're just local thing and then they're all over the world now. Yeah. How do you feel about that?
 
I go through kind feelings, kind of feelings. But what I have, nobody can take it from me. And I try to, I party as many as I can because I have to leave a legacy back here and a lot out there already a lot out there. Santa Davis a good job of that too. He play for me too and I show him, he bring me took control thing too and wasn't great. Jovan plenty. Tell them what they were. Me where we teach music as much as I can. I know I teach them licks. You see, I know that have certain thing of a certain song and a certain way to word certain. I know that in the book master I can't tell you. But I never learned it that way. What I learned with no music, I just use anything. I do anything but I get the sound. So I couldn't just teach a man how I know it. But I teach him the song and sometimes I hold it. I show how I hold it as a big inversion and some wild inversion too. But I'll get the song I want.
 
Well that's like Roscoe Gordon told me he taught himself piano but his sister got lessons and he would listen through the door and then go to the piano and he didn't know how to do it. He just got it till he got the sound right.
 
That is one. That's good. But what I'm telling guitar, we have to find the song before we can bring it out. They don't want to lay down on the piano, just lick what you want. We have to go find it before we can leak it. So the brains were treat them as hard. Yes.
 
Guitars are top of instrument than a piano.
 
And that's why I trombone is I run crazy five times. Five times it worked harder than the other man. Five times guy about to fire son and drop. I take that me right before motor trombone had to get killed. Crazy. Worked too hard. He brain worked too hard. I mean I know that not I should have God give the music before without I buy a book. So I don't want buying a book now. I just satisfy what God give me and can I say, well God do this for me. He know that I was dumb. I never got to school. So all you got to tell you about no school in there. No school. When I 43 years old, government gave me a school for a year to teach construction because they wanted to teach and school. And I was so good at construction when I was told I was go up there for audition, I was the third one is, oh you ready for school right now?
 
And they sent me for to a school I'd already to take their teaching. Yet I have all the practical but I need some theory. So I said, well you get your teaching. I tell them, I said, well you need some teaching. But right now when the mans are going to sit and right to school from interview to school and the mother guy stay here and learn and come out and when everything is sacred down, we got to take my one ear. We just done one time come back three different big schools that teach. We leave the biggest one in America. So I'm definitely that construction man. But music is, the sideline was supposed to be my first line, but they were work out. So I still looking a man who I confident with music as I come here and say all You're still playing? Yeah.
 
Oh yes. That's fantastic. Something to do. Yes. Can't stop. Long as the finger move, long song going to be there. Wow. I do a like gospel and kind of it kind of funny like with that guy named Mikey. Mikey, but what I can't get you Eugene and Time against me. I find this guy named Mikey. He can't do a little and give you this. So he give me a copy of it, but I don't like the copy I didn't give and cd. So that's a thumb drive out there. Yeah. So it make it to one know it wasn't in Regg step. What they make it back just one drop? No. So I don't hear so.